cam gears, can they make such a difference?


rice

rice

b18c baby
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whenever i go to my local honda meet there is this dude who eveyone calls the honda guru and tweaks all their cars.
he has always gone on to me about getting a set of cam gears and bringing my car to him and he will make it quicker.
i however am skeptical about what he says and dont think its gonna do anything.
then my friend in his eagerness to keep up with my b18c ek9 in his civic saloon the 1.8 170 bhp one went to him with a set of gears.

as you could imagine my car beats him by a good bit BUT after letting this dude adjust his cam timing with the gears i cant shake him:shocked:.
i cant believe it and i can assure you thats all he has had done, both cars already had i/h/e and this wasnt done on a dyno. the guy reckons he has a book with what setting to use depending on mods.

how can this be? its made far more of a difference than doing i/h/e and im just shocked and acyually considering the same.

input appreciated:nice:
 
cam gears are needed when u install after market cams and dont degree them in and go to the dyno and move them around for peak power. even in some case's when u follow the spec sheet that the cam manufacture give u its still not perfect and can be moved around for power. every engine is different and no same car is gonna use the same gear adjustments even if the two motors are identicial in components.
gears are also needed when cylinder heads are milled because your taking material away from the head which is gonna effect your cam timing.
this honda guru is hardly a guru. if all the cars have stock cams all he is doing is shifting the power forward or backwards. even if they do have after market cams adjusting them on the street is hardly gonna do anything. how can u tell if u make more power? i wouldnt trust a butt dyno.
 
i have put my car up against his countless times and know how much slower it is but now i can barely get 2 lengths by the end of 4th. if you was in my position you would see it doesnt take rocket science to notice his car is faster no doubt.
 
trust me hes not making to much of a difference. theres different tricks u can do. lets say u put adjustable gears on your ek9 and retard both gears. this is gonna move your power band foward which would give an advantage for highway pull. advance them both your gonna have all your power come early and the car will be very torquey. also there is a small sweet spot on factory setups that sometimes can make power by playing with overlap of the cam ( advance intake & retard exhaust), this is also common on aftermarket cams.
u are mistaking when u think cam gears will get u 10hp on factory cams.
 
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sek2dts@aol.com said:
trust me hes not making to much of a difference. theres different tricks u can do. lets say u put adjustable gears on your ek9 and retard both gears. this is gonna move your power band foward which would give an advantage for highway pull. advance them both your gonna have all your power come early and the car will be very torquey. also there is a small sweet spot on factory setups that sometimes can make power by playing with overlap of the cam ( advance intake & retard exhaust), this is also common on aftermarket cams.
u are mistaking when u think cam gears will get u 10hp on factory cams.
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dude i completely agree with you and told my mate its a waste of money but it has actually made a more than noticeable difference.
if you could see the car before and after you would see the difference thats the weird thing.
i was waiting to tell him i told you so when the car came back but looks like he has had the last laugh unless it blows up.
 
rice said:
dude i completely agree with you and told my mate its a waste of money but it has actually made a more than noticeable difference.
if you could see the car before and after you would see the difference thats the weird thing.
i was waiting to tell him i told you so when the car came back but looks like he has had the last laugh unless it blows up.
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like i said above. he could have played with the overlap, maybe made an extra
5hp MAX and retarded those gear settings for more top end or he's not telling all the mods he has. your making this out to be bigger than it is.lol if your that pissed about him beating u take out your spare, fill your rear tires up to 70psi. adjustable cam gears are not worth putting on stock cams in opinion.
 
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agreed, cam gears are just to put aftermarket cams in there right place, if you have OEM cams no need for gears...
 
blinx9900 said:
agreed, cam gears are just to put aftermarket cams in there right place, if you have OEM cams no need for gears...
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+1

aftermarket cam needs adjustable camgears but with stock cams, adjustable camgears are usless. :)
 
I disagree. Shifting the powerband can be essential for where and how you drive. If you are mostly city driving, that extra 5whp earlier on is a welcome addition.

But with that said, it's as others have stated, don't expect a very large jump in power.
 
cant stock cams with -2 degrees on each and +4 on ignition timing increase power...???? (think that was it) Seen a test in one of the "How to build Honda Horsepower" books...
 
Niall M said:
cant stock cams with -2 degrees on each and +4 on ignition timing increase power...???? (think that was it) Seen a test in one of the "How to build Honda Horsepower" books...
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no. as stated above no two engines are the same. you and i can have to identical motors, same bottom end, same cams, same exhaust, same mileage, same everything. there is no universal setting for cam timing and ignition timing. i am also not saying its not possible that those setting made power on that car i am saying those setting will not have the same results on every car.

i dont see a purpose in this trend of using adjustable gears on stock cams. your wasting so much effort and time to gain a small amout of power when u can just buy a set of cams and gears and make good power and not waste your time playing with the stock ones.
 
You'll also find this affects the mixture and he be running slightly leaner at certain areas and richer in others across the range.
 
RagingAngel said:
I disagree. Shifting the powerband can be essential for where and how you drive. If you are mostly city driving, that extra 5whp earlier on is a welcome addition.

But with that said, it's as others have stated, don't expect a very large jump in power.
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I agree with you also, I used cam gears on my ex B18C with oem cams, and I was able to gain 4 whp and 2lbs/ft of torque :nice:

Its not that much tho.... But if you have aftermarket camshafts you MUST have after market cam gears, and a good ones, that can measure the degrees in 0.5, I think skunk 2 pro series are a good choice :nice:
 
Vernier pulleys (Cam Gears) are very much necessary to dial in neutral cam timing when using aftermarket cams....

These cams are often not ground exactly as per the OEM specs so a vernier allows the timing to be swung. They are especially useful if the head has been skimmed after gas flowing.

The effect of skimming (~removing metal from the lower surface of~) the head makes the cam pulleys sit closer to the crank pulley. Therefore when the cambelt is correctly tensioned, the cams move to take up the slack in the belt due to the skimmed head.

Id not bother on a standard engine, Honda knew what they were doing.....but very important if the car has aftermarket cams IMO:)
 
Old post I know but surely all these new cams are machined on a billet and therefore should be ok on the standard cam gears? If they were re machined I'd understand but are they really that necessary on an unmachined head?
 
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