What Makes a B16b


ry4N

ry4N

Vtec solider
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Jul 30, 2007
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528
Right guys,

This might be a bit of a weird question but an interesting on at least.
I am currently looking at different paths to take with my ek9 for a project (built motor, turbo, engine swaps ect)

One thing has been in the back of my head for a while and i thought i would post it up and put it to the masses :D


What makes the B16b the engine is it??

ie; Revvy and but short on power in low revs?

the reason i ask this is because alot of people compare the b16b and b18c; saying that the 18c is dull yet powerful and the 16b being weak in the low end but extremely revvy!
Two engines with two very different characteristics, however alot of people claim that minus the 200cc these engines are virtually the same!

Let me know your ideas on the subject guys :D
 
I dont think i have ever heard anyone say a B18c is dull?! maybe a standard B16B but not a B18!

I don't think either of them are any more revvy. To me they rev just the same..thats my personal driving experience anyway. That extra 200cc from the B18 really does give extra grunt over the B16B and is definitely worth having.

Your question is a big vague to be honest and very difficult to asnwer..maybe why no one has till me!

If you have the choice to go B18, then do it mate.
 
I dunno man, having been in EK9's with both B16 & B18, I would say the B16 feels more rev happy. Perhaps it's a deceptive feeling, but I feel it no doubt.

And actually, based on that feel, I prefer the B16.

I know a lot of guys just blanket the subject and refuse to believe that anyone could prefer the B16 over the B18, but I think that's just small mindedness speaking (not intended at any post above, based on previous experiences). I for one do prefer the B16, and also know others that do..
 
I definitely know what you mean about the B16B being more "revvy" but i really put that down to the lack of torque. Vtec kick's are basically the same in both but of course due to the lack of the torque in the 16 i think thats why it feels a bit more revvier. But thats just my opinion...i too love the B16b! im just saying the torque from the B18 is worth it..
 
I think Mine's R34 is a good example of what you's are talking about (because of the power figures the difference is slightly easier to see than with B series engines), they are one of the few Japanese RB tuners that refused to stroke the engine out to a 2.8 because although the 2.8 gave more power and torque in the same tune as the 2.6 they reaconed that the engine lost it's responsiveness which they felt was more important for driveability and it was a more thrilling experience (in 2.6 config.), and as we all know this same skyline held a lot of track records that were untouchable for a long time!!
the bottom line is a higher cc engine has more work to do... more fuel/air to compress, slightly more weight in the form of bigger pistons and a larger surface area (bore to piston ring mating face) so therefore more friction and a overall larger roatational mass.
So a smaller cc car is nippy of the line but once air resistance starts to become a factor as the speed increases this is were the difference in cc starts to come back.
but then if its a track car your after there norm arent any huge changes in speed (compared to drag racing) so responsiveness is more favorable.

Hope this doesnt come across as waffle and helps you a bit!! :)
 
b16b has more aggressive cams and vtec swithover seems more because of the lack of torque as well .
 
civiclife said:
b16b has more aggressive cams and vtec swithover seems more because of the lack of torque as well .
Click to expand...

The only difference with B16b cam's is the extra 3 degrees of duration on the intake cam.. not huge.
 
When I spent a RR day with the ITR-DC2 lot a while back, there was two EK9s there, including mine. Quite a few of the Teggy lads said that the B16B sounded more agressive from inside the rollers. And I have heard that the 16 more freely revving than the 18, probably as explained above.
 
civiclife said:
vtec swithover seems more because of the lack of torque as well .
Click to expand...

It's cause of the slight drop in power before the VTEC "kick" that Honda deliberately programmed into the map to give a more aggressive changeover.
 
i never usually get involved in these topics but i have to laugh. feeling free'r to rev. the engines are identical (bar the 3 degrees longer duration on the intake cam of the b16b) the itr also has a larger throttle body.

the idea that there is any substancial difference is mad. as the ek shell is slightly lighter they destroked the already in production b18c engine from the earlier model and tweeked the cam timing to suit the 1600cc. with same cams the were already down 15ps due to displacement alone (excluding throttle body differences). the idea some have of the revvier feel comes from the higher torque position on the small engine this is because to get the most with less displacement they move the torque band up slightly. thats why the corss over seems so mcuh more of a bang than the 1800cc engine, esp in the 98 spec as the exhaust manifold and newer map lower the vtec point and torque curve, not sue exact numbers but check it out. the 98 spec has the smoothest (or weakest depenends on how you look at it) vtec rosss over point.

also the compression ration is less in the 1600, again inducing less torque and power output. the rev limit is also 200 rpm higher in 98 b18. usually lower capacity engines can run higher rev limits as rotational forces are less and therefore safer.

so why would you pick a b16b? sorry to say but there are not many reasons to over a b18c.

i really like the b16b in the ek9 dont get me wrong it is suitable for that car stock but if you could have a stroked b16 or even b18c (pretty much identical) then why not 15 ps about 20f/lbs of torque.

why has honda gone 2ltr in the newer models? evolution :)
 
Agree 100% with webartie.
I personally think, that the most inflential factor on how fast a car is, is the skill of the driver.
A good driver in a near stock ek9, will nearly always get th ebetter of a bad driver in a modded ek9. Just my opinion.
 
so there is no difference whatsoever in the cams ? i was told there was but never knew for myself . as far as i know sir/vti cams are stage 1 but type-r are stage 3 - is this correct ??
 
Hey!A very good reading here. . .!Great info guys. What abt b16 head with a b18 bottom end?? I had heard from alot of tuners or tuner from japan that they are doin the same. Will this make a better engine?
 
civiclife said:
so there is no difference whatsoever in the cams ? i was told there was but never knew for myself . as far as i know sir/vti cams are stage 1 but type-r are stage 3 - is this correct ??
Click to expand...

There is between the B18C and B16B cams, but only on the intake and as said above it's only by 3 degrees. I also believe (but not 100%) that that is before VTEC and the VTEC lobes are the same.
 
why has honda gone 2ltr in the newer models? evolution :)[/QUOTE]

Hi guys im a newbie on the forum all the way from south africa, iv always asked the guys down here in s.a way would honda come out with a 2lt in the new type r and from what i know the b18c and b16b is stronger. In sa we get the type r doing 148kw and the b18c engines that we import do 152kw and 210hp. I know stats are one thing you need to put the power to the ground iv got a few friends with a b18c stock setup and whether they go rolling or from the line b18c is in front by a huge margine. Correct me if im wrong guys
 
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