DC5=disapointment

[steveonagle]

All the people saying about a B18 swap into an ek9, couldnt you just bore the B16 to a 1.8 for the same results? (sorry for going off topic)

i was going to do this ended up being cheaper to go b18 wich i did having said that stroke the b16b and keep the cams and you have one quick b18 only problem is a good aftermarket ecu is needed to keep things in check

 

[kaks_EK9Rx]

What?! Thats BS! theres even more rawness with a jdm K20a in it. The power, sound and torque is just amazing! Its like a B18C on s t e r o i d s

Good choice of words

 

[itr16]

VTEC kick is not good...smooth is good...more you modify the smoother it should be

^yeah,i just compared it to old b16 and my k20 whats the ride on it when vtec pulls in.

 

[itr16]

i should imagine its a lot of hard work & twice as expensive

also you would loose some of the ek9/dc2 rawness if you k20'd it.

^its a lot of hardwork but its worth it man
expensive?maybe a little,but if your plan is gonna put in a b18c on it,i would save more money for k20/24.i mean you will gonna spend it also so why should go for a minimal upgrade where you can go for the monster engine and go for light weight chasis.imo
ek9->k20/24 = ftw!

 

[jase_87]

^its a lot of hardwork but its worth it man
expensive?maybe a little,but if your plan is gonna put in a b18c on it,i would save more money for k20/24.i mean you will gonna spend it also so why should go for a minimal upgrade where you can go for the monster engine and go for light weight chasis.imo
ek9->k20/24 = ftw!

yeah a k20'd ek9 would be a beast, but as i've said before you loose some of the ek9 appeal imo

 

[_JT]

^its a lot of hardwork but its worth it man
expensive?maybe a little,but if your plan is gonna put in a b18c on it,i would save more money for k20/24.i mean you will gonna spend it also so why should go for a minimal upgrade where you can go for the monster engine and go for light weight chasis.imo
ek9->k20/24 = ftw!

Why choose a B18c? Cause 2500 or 5000 quid is quite a difference in money (the difference in costs wil become even bigger if you can't do it yourself and the K20 involves a lot of more custom work....eg I think I could do a B18 swap but I cant weld) and for 2500 I can also buy better brakes, better suspension and other upgrades.

 

[EK9dan]

As said I had the whole b18c conversion done £550. The k20 will cost thosands. And you can out accelerate most cars on the b18c that set up.

 

[Vtec6000]

If you swap a K20 in and keep EK subframe the handling is not good due to the engine been to far forward. To do the job right you would want to swap a dc2 subframe in to the EK civic this allows you to use the EKK2 mount's that will position the engine better and also reduce driveshaft angle. Regardless of the niggle's of this swap and the high cost's you just got to love everything about the k20 engine's in a EK or EG chassis the acceleration is unreal so much torque throughout the rev range.

 

[jugbugz]

If you swap a K20 in and keep EK subframe the handling is not good due to the engine been to far forward. To do the job right you would want to swap a dc2 subframe in to the EK civic this allows you to use the EKK2 mount's that will position the engine better and also reduce driveshaft angle. Regardless of the niggle's of this swap and the high cost's you just got to love everything about the k20 engine's in a EK or EG chassis the acceleration is unreal so much torque throughout the rev range.

Either you go EKK1 or EKK2, handling goes down(with EK9 ofcourse). With K-series being 10kgs lighter than B-series, it makes up a lil bit.

If you use EKK2 mounts, you need to swap out the Sub frame and steering rack off a DC2R or EG civic(same parts). Not only that, but the complete LCA, knuckle, etc etc off an EG civic. The EK9 subframe is a lot stronger and LCA is 3 times mass bigger. So you end up have the entire front converted with EG/DC2 parts. The EK9 front LCA is also 2 times thicker than DC2R.

EKK1 mounts sit the engine forward more so you dont need to swap out the subframe and keep everything as is, but brings the engine forward about 5cm or 2inches over the EKK2 mounts.

If your building a Track prep car, then you wont mind going EKK2 with the amount of extra work you need. But for a street car or drag car, the EKK1 mounts is much more cost effective and better for Drag cars. Another downfall is the Driveshafts are not aligned as straight, but wont really make much difference on the street.

After comparing my friends (EKK2) EK+K20a sussy/chassis parts etc, its looks pretty damn weak. He was shocked at the size differences between ek9 LCAs, knuckle, sway bar, etc etc. One thing i can say about his setup is, lots of oversteer, especially with that ASR rear brace, LCA kit, rear 4point strut bar etc.

In the end, with the amount of work and changes in mind and the thought of converting my EK9 front end to an EG...I'm going EKK1...

 

[jugbugz]

As said I had the whole b18c conversion done £550. The k20 will cost thosands. And you can out accelerate most cars on the b18c that set up.

True mate very damn true... but one thing for sure is, you get a future proof car

I think the next generation Type R is still using K20a. Long live the king.

 

[Tmus]

what about the hybrid racing conversion stuff? have you looked into them as well? they seems quite good.

I've looked into K20a drop, but its just not financially viable ATM. it will make more sense to buy a DC5.

definately going K20 a EK in the future though.

 

[jugbugz]

what about the hybrid racing conversion stuff? have you looked into them as well? they seems quite good.

I've looked into K20a drop, but its just not financially viable ATM. it will make more sense to buy a DC5.

definately going K20 a EK in the future though.

Hybrid Racing makes top stuff and are very innovative. If you use their parts though, you need to use all of them if your going to retain stuff like A/C, Power steering, etc. I remember seeing one of their K20 EK project cars and saw the engine position sitting very damn close to the radiator. You couldnt fit a fan if you wanted to. They may have changed this by now though.

 

[RagingAngel]

The EK9 subframe is a lot stronger and LCA is 3 times mass bigger. So you end up have the entire front converted with EG/DC2 parts. The EK9 front LCA is also 2 times thicker than DC2R.

EK9 is stamped steel and the DC2-R is cast. The weight difference is noticeable but strengthwise is similar. There's no question in my mind the EK9 units are superior but it's not something to lose sleep over.

EKK1 mounts sit the engine forward more so you dont need to swap out the subframe and keep everything as is, but brings the engine forward about 5cm or 2inches over the EKK2 mounts.

It also makes the oil pan hang undesirably lower. Better change to a K24 steel pan as most impacts on an aluminum pan causes it to crack. It would be a real pity to ruin a nice motor.

After comparing my friends (EKK2) EK+K20a sussy/chassis parts etc, its looks pretty damn weak.

Yes it LOOKS pretty damn weak, but it does the job and has always done it well.

He was shocked at the size differences between ek9 LCAs, knuckle, sway bar, etc etc. One thing i can say about his setup is, lots of oversteer, especially with that ASR rear brace, LCA kit, rear 4point strut bar etc.

probably just the way he set it up.


Undeniably the K20 is a superior motor in all aspects - but for the amount of money it costs to do this swap that is ill fitting (axles don't usually line up and when they do, the hood might need to be shimmed) and when it's all bad, the motor hangs damn low.... for simplicity's sake, I'd go with a low pressure turbo B which makes more power for less money and will be reliable.

yeah it's a bit low but not excessively tucked. Even if it were raised....well look at the next picture.

OEM filter for ground clearance.

 

[jugbugz]

EK9 is stamped steel and the DC2-R is cast. The weight difference is noticeable but strengthwise is similar. There's no question in my mind the EK9 units are superior but it's not something to lose sleep over.:

By looking at the 2 in person, you'll see that it also looks stronger in design.

It also makes the oil pan hang undesirably lower. Better change to a K24 steel pan as most impacts on an aluminum pan causes it to crack. It would be a real pity to ruin a nice motor.

Good idea, but a simple mod of adding a couple of washers to raise the motor up a bit would add a bit of help. Since the EKK2 mounts sit the motor lower, there should be some headroom for washers.

Yes it LOOKS pretty damn weak, but it does the job and has always done it well.

Its works since its only a civic EK base model. For me, I'd prefer to keep the ek9 LCAs etc rather the puny EG ones.

probably just the way he set it up.

Yeh, he should have further strengthen up the front since the rears are overkill at the current setup. It does have a 3point carbing front strut bar.

Undeniably the K20 is a superior motor in all aspects - but for the amount of money it costs to do this swap that is ill fitting (axles don't usually line up and when they do, the hood might need to be shimmed) and when it's all bad, the motor hangs damn low.... for simplicity's sake, I'd go with a low pressure turbo B which makes more power for less money and will be reliable.

but k20/all-motor fans wont agree. They'd still love to go through all that trouble.


Heres a comparison of engine positioning between all the well-knowned engine mounts for kswap. All pics are from k20a.org projects

EKK1

EKK2

Hybrid Racing

By looking at those pics, the EKK1 and EKK2 5cm difference is a little exagerated, nothing to worry about too much. but comparing it to the Hybrid Racing postioning is a different story. You can still get a radiator fan onto both EKK1 and EKK2 mounts. But NO WAY on the Hybrid racing.

For me, I can't be stuffed stripping weaker parts off an EG/DC2 and have it all swapped over which includes sway bars etc and having spare EK9 parts lying around. If I have to get a stronger oil pan or add washers to the engine mount to get better height on the motor, then I'd prefer that. But no way I'll use Hybrid Racing mounts and have the motor sitting that far up front.

Besides, for me its a street car and the swap will be done myself at home. If there are something that is of critical concern, i can swap mounts anytime. But atm, nothing comes to mind